The Book-keepers Forum (BKF)

Post Info TOPIC: Bookkeeping client who is an IFA


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:
Bookkeeping client who is an IFA


 I am a self employed BK and have been asked to quote on bookkeeping and quarterly VAT for an independent financial advisor trading as a sole director ltd company 

Income and outgoings very straightforward from preliminary chat and VAT is currently being done by the accountant supplying stat accounts and is being charged fairly heftily for just the BK and VAT return element 

I'm due to have a call with potential client  to discuss this week  and as I have never supplied BK to an IFA before then I just wanted to double check if there is anything I should be wary of as I can't work out why client is being charged so much just for the BK and vat submission when everything seems very basic so I almost feel like I'm missing something

 

Thanks in advance 

 

KM

 

Thanks in advance 

 

KM



-- Edited by KMBookkeeping on Tuesday 12th of January 2021 07:11:13 PM



-- Edited by KMBookkeeping on Tuesday 12th of January 2021 07:12:09 PM

__________________
AC


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 19
Date:

KMBookkeeping wrote:

I am a self employed BK and have been asked to quote on bookkeeping and quarterly VAT for an independent financial advisor trading as a sole director ltd company 

Income and outgoings very straightforward from preliminary chat and VAT is currently being done by the accountant supplying stat accounts and is being charged fairly heftily for just the BK and VAT return element 

I'm due to have a call with potential client  to discuss this week  and as I have never supplied BK to an IFA before then I just wanted to double check if there is anything I should be wary of as I can't work out why client is being charged so much just for the BK and vat submission when everything seems very basic so I almost feel like I'm missing something

 

Thanks in advance 

 

KM


 'charged fairly heftily'

 

What is the hefty charge?   What qualifications does Accountant have? (out of interest).  

 

 



__________________

AC



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:

£1500 pa just for basic quarterly VAT submission on apx 30 transactions a month , client is sending them a detailed breakdown and receipts so bookkeeping entries would not take much time . 

Turnover 100k apx 

 

Additional charge for directors payroll and accounts prep and stat filings at end of year . Don't know how extra much is being charged for this or qualifications of accountant . Client only currently wants to outsource the vat submission ( which is fine as my current licence doesnt cover ltd company account filing )

 

 



__________________
AC


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 19
Date:

Fee not unreasonable given complexities/recent and impending changes and assumed knowledge base re Accountant (#) You will need to know who so you can send your prof enq letter so will find out.

If price pointing now, he will do it to you. (Race to bottom)

'Detailed breakdown'. Of what? Is that MTD compliant? 30 transactions per month PLUS receipts? Have you seen? What state? Clients lie and say they do not have much/it is easy/it is organised.

IR35. Partial exemption. Can you fully defend in event of enquiry?

 (#) Good link on aweb, esp 2 points made today by 'practice for sale' and 'paddy55' https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/any-answers/potential-client-shocked-at-proposed-fee

Practice for sale

A chap had a erally annoying 'clonk' every few minutes in his plumbing. A series of plumbers 'bled' the system charging £45+vat each time. Each time within a day the noise was back.

A new plumber in town (but a very old chap) offered to come and sort it out. He spent 5 minutes gently tapping various parts of the system, then with a large soft headed hammer hit the bottom of the water tank quite hard. Noises stopped immediately.

"That'll be £150+vat please"

"What!!! for 5 minutes work??? How can you justify that???!!!"

"That's £30 for the call out and the 5 minutes tapping and hitting, and £120 for the 40 years experience which meant I know where to tap and hit"

Moral of the story? Don't underprice for anyone ever. Charge the right price to do the job properly.

(PS, I dont always follow my own advice, but that doesnt mean its not good advice LOL)

Paddy 55

 I have noticed lately that small businesses are doing their best to be quoted a low fee. I suspect that one of the reasons behind this is that they realise that the smaller the fee, the less work the accountant can afford to spend on the job. He is likely to skimp on verifying the facts, accept without question all the information that the client provides. The accountant is likely to gravitate to a a "file-only" tax return. Thus the client will kill two birds with one stone i.e. lower fee and no questions asked.I

 



__________________

AC



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 675
Date:

KMBookkeeping wrote:

£1500 pa just for basic quarterly VAT submission on apx 30 transactions a month , client is sending them a detailed breakdown and receipts so bookkeeping entries would not take much time . 

Turnover 100k apx 

 

Additional charge for directors payroll and accounts prep and stat filings at end of year . Don't know how extra much is being charged for this or qualifications of accountant . Client only currently wants to outsource the vat submission ( which is fine as my current licence doesnt cover ltd company account filing )

 

 


 

From things I've seen elsewhere, £350/£375 seems to be a quite common charge for a chartered doing even a basic VAT return.  Hopefully the clients bookkeeping will be as easy and straightforward as they have made it sound.  No idea how you price of course but don't charge him less than half of that amount - he'll have reduced his fee by half so he's happy and you may well be earning more than you would do normally so you're happy!

In terms of doing VAT for IFAs I wouldn't say that there were any specific issues to look out for over any other professional services type person. If you are only doing the VAT then I would say that his IR35 status (as picked up on by AC) wouldn't be your responsibility.

 



__________________

Jenny

 

Responses are my opinion based on the information provided.  All information should be thoroughly checked before being relied on.

 



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:

Thanks both

My main worry was there was something I was missing about ie IR35 status

Budget B - yes thank you , wise pricing advice . I'm not VAT registered so he will lose out on a reclaim there but my standard fee should still save him £500 a year with that in mind so worth the consult call for both us hopefully

Much appreciated

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Date:

I would not do it for that price. Agree with AC race to bottom. It has started. Also agree with AC - Exemption is in point. You dont answer the MTD issue.

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:

Thanks 

Client currently sends a spreadsheet of recorded expense totals and scans of each receipt over to accountant quarterly 

My software is MTD compliant 

As a bookkeeper rather than an accountant then if I'm charging at my standard rate ( which I would be ) then is there something I should be wary of in the above situation 

He would still be paying and receiving advice from accountant regarding IR35 so wouldn't my liability be limited as I am merely charging for basic bookkeeping and VAT submission . 

As this is my standard rate ( and I would imagine a fairly mid level rate for most bookkeepers who aren't accountants ) then I'm loathe to turn it down without good reason as if I'm charging my usual rate I don't feel like I'm partaking in a race to the bottom as they are the standard rates I can charge given my non accountant status

 



-- Edited by KMBookkeeping on Thursday 14th of January 2021 04:37:06 PM

__________________



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Date:

It is not your software that you should be concerned about in terms of MTD compliance, but how the data gets into your software. Looks at the rules for digital links.Perhaps have a re-read of comments.

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:

Thank you - I'll dive deeper then



__________________


Master Book-keeper

Status: Offline
Posts: 3637
Date:

Go for it KM, even at half the price it's worth doing.  Bookkeeping fee at around £25 an hour plus add on charge for VAT return and it's easily covered.  If you can get more good, but all this race to the bottom stuff is sphericals in my opinion.  Yes, you can be too cheap I agree and I have been at times, but £25 an hour is (again in my opinion) not to be sniffed at, especially in the current situation.

 

MAAT, I don't see why there would be an issue with MTD.  Can be imported and the receipts checked or simply key the receipts in from scratch.



__________________

John 

 

 

 Any advice given is for general guidance and professional advice should be sought applicable to your circumstances.



Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Date:

Leger wrote:

 

 

MAAT, I don't see why there would be an issue with MTD.  Can be imported and the receipts checked or simply key the receipts in from scratch.


 Of course. But OP suggested her software was compliant so that covered it. It does not, as I said above. So making OP more aware of the wider picture, her responsibilities and need for wider reading is surely being helpful.   Encouraged to research rather than spoon feed.



__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 6
Date:

Thanks both

That shines some light . 

I was assuming that it was taken as read that I'd be manually checking and inputting the receipts which was an error on my part  but it was good to refresh on the digital link rules 

 

Have a nice day 



__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Date:

There could be an argument that says he is doing his own bookkeeping at least in part. Whether its correct or not is another issue, probably highly doubtful, especially with the VAT issue on the income side knock on effect.

__________________



Master Book-keeper

Status: Offline
Posts: 3637
Date:

Maat wrote:
Leger wrote:

 

 

MAAT, I don't see why there would be an issue with MTD.  Can be imported and the receipts checked or simply key the receipts in from scratch.


 Of course. But OP suggested her software was compliant so that covered it. It does not, as I said above. So making OP more aware of the wider picture, her responsibilities and need for wider reading is surely being helpful.   Encouraged to research rather than spoon feed.


Ok, my apologies, it seemed pretty straight forward to me.



__________________

John 

 

 

 Any advice given is for general guidance and professional advice should be sought applicable to your circumstances.

Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.

Tweet this page Post to Digg Post to Del.icio.us
Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  

©2007-2019 The Book-keepers Forum (BKF). All Rights Reserved. The Book-keepers Forum (BKF) is a trading division of Bookcert Ltd. Registered in England Company Number 05782923. 2 Laurel House, 1 Station Rd, Worle, Weston-super-Mare, North Somerset, BS22 6AR, United Kingdom. The Book-keepers Forum and BKF are trademarks of Bookcert Ltd. This forum is a discussion forum only. There will usually be more than one opinion to any question and any posting should not be viewed as a definitive solution. No responsibility for loss occasioned to any person acting or refraining from action as a result of any posting on this site is accepted by the contributors or The Book-keepers Forum. In all cases, appropriate professional advice should be sought before making a decision. We reserve the right to remove any postings which are offensive, libellous, self-promoting or engaged in covert marketing. We will not notify users of removals. The views expressed in the forum posts are those of the individual and do not necessary reflect or agree with those of The Book-keepers Forum. Any offensive or unsuitable posts will be removed by the moderators. Any reader of this forum can request for a post to be looked into by sending an email to: info@bookcert.co.uk.

Privacy & Cookie Policy  About